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TUPE - New role different to previous role

 
TUPE - New role different to previous role

I just wondered if anyone could advise me on this. I was recently TUPE transferred into another company and retained my same job title and salary. As this was the same I was happy to go. However, it is now clear that being an administrator at my old post had a lot more responsibility than being an adnimistrator at my new post. The other problem is to be able to obtain the same level of responsibility would be a grade move up for me in the new job.

As moving up a grade may be resisted from my new employer, I wondered how 'strong' the case is for maintaining the same level of responsibility after TUPE. I saw the other persons post on TUPE but I do not want to resign or be made redundant.

chooks23

10/12/2009 18:47:45

Hi

It is all a matter of degree, involving all of the applicable facts, but you might hypothetically argue that your TUPEd role is so dissimilar to your previous one that, unless they have a better-matching one, it amounts to redundancy, unless you choose to accept the 'lesser' role.

Presumably, it's only job satisfaction or the like that's resulting in the disparity - your terms and conditions, including pay, ought to be unaffected ?

Please explain if different !

bubbles_once

10/12/2009 19:02:23

Hi, Yes it is purely job satisfaction I have tried for a month to accept I am getting a decent salary for 'filing' but I did have another offer on the table before the TUPE and turned it down due to continuity of service and I expected the same job.

I have noted my concerns with HR so we will see what/if anything comes of it. I just thought under TUPE the acutal tasks had to be similar.

Thanks anyway bubbles.

chooks23

10/12/2009 19:07:46

The job roles ought indeed to equate, which is the whole ethos of TUPE.

If they don't, then you're into all the iffy and labyrinthine and incomprehensible bits of TUPE !

But, your alternative, probably is 'only' redundancy......

bubbles_once

10/12/2009 19:26:23

Maybe you can also help with another uncertainty. Initially the company did not agree I was within scope for TUPE - I was not client facing - I obtained evidence using timesheets and email correspondence proving I worked on the contract more than 50%.

Not sure what you do bubbles, but if you are involved with this stuff do employers generally see this as 'troublemaking'?

chooks23

10/12/2009 19:46:08

No, not at all 'troublemaking'- you ought, under TUPE to have been transferred to an equivalent role - if this is not the case, then I think you might have a reasonable argument for redundancy, etc.

TUPE is indeed a 'black art' and best left to magicians, but suppose it depens on how far you want to pursue - but seems you have a case. at least.

bubbles_once

10/12/2009 20:29:32

Quick Quesitons

What if the employer disagrees that its different reponsabilities and refuses to accept redunancy? (can they do this?) I'm in a similar position to the original poster at the moment and we are currently involved in a takeover.

Currently my 'product manager' role is much more wide ranging and challenging than what they would define their existing 'product manager. role to be.

From a personal position I've never felt I've been able to negotiate a decent market rate for my responsabilities and skills with my previous employer and now find myself in a 'product manager' role that is far more 'simpler' and could be considered 'market rate' however the skills I feel I've developed over the last year have led me to believe that the 'equivalent' role on offer is just not interesting enough.

I'm guessing that providing the employer accepts redundancy is the only option?

ChrisBlk

19/01/2010 19:24:02

Assuming your existing pay and conditions don't change, you can only reasonably expect a broadly similar role with the 'new' employer.

If the only one available is significantly / unreasonably different, then, yes, in these circumstances, redundancy is probably the only other option.

bubbles_once

19/01/2010 19:37:32

TUPE Question - similar lines..

I have recently been TUPE'd across from an NHS service to a non-statutory service along with the two administrators I line managed and an administrator from another service. The JD I was TUPE'd over on was much higher than the new service have in their organisation. All four of us were identified as 'jobs at risk' as they only have three roles - one senior and two junior, and that there would be competitive interviewing for the . I was led to believe that during the initial period there would be no change to roles and it would be 'business as usual' and there would be consultation with each individual should changes be made to their role. Within three days in the new organisation during a meeting that my new line manager, I was informed that I no longer have line management nor supervision of the two junior staff - this is a huge change to my role. I have voiced that this is still in the TUPE consultation period and as such I would've expected as a minimum a discussion regarding this. We are all meeting this week and I would very much like some advice please.

Smartie1

23/01/2010 10:22:09

Hi

Afraid there seems little to prevent implementation of this redundancy, provided it all proceeds as if the tupe transfer had never taken place.

For example, your team can't face selection for redundancy just because you recently transferred - if appropriate, all other staff there ought to be considered for inclusion in the selection pool.

The logic here is that the redundancy might well have happened had you remained with your former employer, and tupe won't add to any protection here but neither must it diminish it.

bubbles_once

23/01/2010 11:30:20

Job title and description change

Hello, I wonder if i can find some help to my TUPE related issue.

I transferred to my new employer under tupe terms in 2002. In January 2009 i was moved into another part of the business. I retained my job title and conditions but the role changed significantly. My line manager now wants me to change my job title and job description so that it is in line with my new role.

I am not very happy with my new role and put myself forward for redundancy. My application was refused.

I would like to retain myu job title and job description. where do i stand? Can I be forced to accept my new terms and conditions and can my job title be changed?

regards dl

dlicheri

09/03/2010 13:17:25

In terms of the TUPE transfer this is a dead issue. TUPE protections tend to "wear off" and this much later there is no protection left. Whether your employer can change your terms and conditions etc is more complex and you really haven't told us enough to provide you with any meaningful advice. However, if you have been doing the job already and this is just a "tidying up" of what is already a fact, then there may be very little that you can do. But we would need more information about what is happening to help.

shikahra

09/03/2010 13:35:58